A Journey of a Professional Irrigation Engineer - 10

In this episode of the Agricultural Engineering Podcast, we explore the career of Isobel van der Stoep, a professionally registered Agricultural Engineer with over 25 years of experience. From her early days contributing to the Irrigation Design Manual and the National Water Act of 1998 to her current role managing tens of thousands of hectares of sugarcane estates across Africa. Isobel's story is a masterclass in professional growth and technical leadership.

You can find her on LinkedIn as Isobel van der Stoep, https://www.linkedin.com/in/isobel-van-der-stoep-5018b846/ 

SABI Magazine, https://sabi.co.za/magazine/

Contact us on: senzo@saiae.co.za

Transcript

(Intro Music - upbeat with nature sounds)

Khuthadzo Ntsua: Hello, and welcome to the Agricultural Engineering Podcast. This podcast covers all aspects of agricultural engineering. It is produced by the South African Institute of Agricultural Engineers. The series of episodes that will be brought to you has been funded by the Royal Academy of Engineering. We encourage you to tune in and explore the exciting world of agricultural engineering with us. My name is Khuthadzo Ntsua and I'm your host for today's episode.

Welcome back to the Agricultural Engineering Podcast. I know it's been a minute, but we are back still exploring ideas and innovations in agricultural engineering with people who are shaping the field. Today we are going to explore the journey of an agricultural engineer who is working in sustainable irrigation and water management. Miss Isabel van der Stoep, a professionally registered agricultural engineer with over 25 years of experience across Africa.

Isabel's career spans irrigation design, water measurement, sub-surface drainage, training, consulting, and large-scale project management. She has worked in South Africa, Mozambique, Eswatini, Namibia, Angola, Malawi, and Tanzania, bringing practical solutions to some of the region's most challenging water and irrigation environments. She has also held leadership positions as President of the South African Institute of Agricultural Engineers between 2013 and 2017 and the South African Irrigation Institute between 2008 and 2009, contributing to shaping the direction of agricultural engineering. Welcome, Isabel, to the Agricultural Engineering Podcast, and thank you for taking your time to be with us today.

Isabel van der Stoep: Thank you so much, Kutatzo, and thanks for the invitation from SAIAE.

Khuthadzo Ntsua: So, I could not put you in a box. Your professional journey is one of the most inspiring journeys I've ever witnessed. From working in academia, small-farmer irrigation development, and now you manage large sugarcane estates in Eswatini, Zambia, Malawi, and Tanzania. What initially drew you to the field of irrigation engineering?

Isabel van der Stoep: Yeah, it's been quite a—quite a journey already, and it's been a very, very satisfying one. And I'm very grateful for all the opportunities I've had over the years. And I think before one talks about irrigation engineering, maybe just agricultural engineering. So, when I had to decide what I wanted to study, I had two big boxes to tick. And the one was I wanted to work outside, or to have the opportunity to work outside, but I also didn't particularly want to work with people. I didn't want to manage people or work with them that much.

So, and that's how I ended up doing or studying agricultural engineering. And getting into irrigation particularly, I think that was pure luck. And it's again, when I was studying, at the end of the first year, it wasn't actually compulsory for us to do vacation work, but I wanted to. So I went to the—what is then still Department of Agriculture, and was now the ARC's Agricultural Engineering Institute in Pretoria. And I said, "I'm a first-year student, can I do some holiday work in that December?"

And in that year, they placed me in the Directorate for Irrigation Engineering. And at the time, they were actually busy compiling the Irrigation Design Manual. So, yeah, that was—that's how I got into it. It was purely by luck, and I don't regret it for a day. After that, I stayed involved with the people from the first year's work, and eventually it also helped me to get my first job and it really set me up for life.

Khuthadzo Ntsua: And to think that the irrigation manual is still being used today in lectures. But that's not the only thing you've contributed to that still has impact today. Earlier when you started your career, you worked on the National Water Act. How did that experience shape your understanding of water governance and efficiency?

Isabel van der Stoep: Yeah, it was to be honest, when I started working, you know, when I got my first position, I was working for MBB, and I was specifically—MBB Consulting Engineers—but specifically in a section within the engineering firm that was contracted to provide that consultation service for—for the National Water Act. And at that time, they were also looking at the Irrigation Act and a lot of things were going on. And you know, when you start working, and you don't have any context of how things work, or how politics work and things like that, you don't—you don't realize that this was a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity because it's not—not often that any country compiles or writes a new act, and even a new Water Act.

So, at the time I was—I was not that happy about doing the work because actually I found—I felt that I just come out of university and I've learned all these important engineering things and now I end up doing this sort of consulting work where we driving people around, we're having a lot of meetings and talking a lot and writing long documents. And I was actually a bit frustrated with the process at the beginning, but looking back, it was such a unique opportunity. Because the people that you were introduced to, that went on for long after that to—to open doors and to help one understand things better. So, it really was, at that time I didn't appreciate it too much, but looking back and later on when we started looking at other research on governance, it really set me up for life as well.

Khuthadzo Ntsua: Now, thinking about the Water Act and its intention, and looking at the current status of water infrastructure in South Africa, where some communities don't have water—I'm talking about not for irrigation, but merely for household uses. Where do you think things went wrong, and do you still think there's proper governance according to the Water Act?

Isabel van der Stoep: Yeah, I think that's—we need another whole hour of discussion on that. But you know, at the time, the—that new National Water Act of 1998 was probably the best Water Act in the world when it was written. It was, and it still is. But you know, implementing something is quite a different kettle of fish. That's, I think, that's where maybe we—we dropped the ball a little bit. We had a really good act, but when we got to the implementation side, I don't—I don't think we succeeded in implementing it as it was intended. It was, it's still there and there's nothing stopping us from still trying to implement it, but I think at this stage we probably—we're definitely not 100% there, we're probably between 50 and 60 percent on how we are making use of all the mechanisms that's available to us.

Khuthadzo Ntsua: So those contributions towards the Irrigation Design Manual as well as the Water Act drafting were not the only place where you found yourself challenging yourself to work with people. You've continuously worked with people to a point when you even led SABI and you also led the South African Institute of Agricultural Engineers. So how did these roles influence your vision for sustainable irrigation in South Africa?

Isabel van der Stoep: Yeah, it was a privilege to—to act in both of those capacities for the times that it was. I think with the Irrigation Institute, it was around 2008 and then with the Institute for Agricultural Engineers, it was around 2013 to 2014. Yeah, and again, I think, you know, like you said earlier, I wanted to study engineering because I didn't want to work with people. But you know, they're just everywhere. You cannot get away from them.

Khuthadzo Ntsua: (Laughing) I think the same thing, I'm like, you are back to people again!

Isabel van der Stoep: Again, yeah! And I mean, even before that, I was a lecturer at the university. I mean, it's just people everywhere. You cannot get away from them. But anyway, I think as you—as you grow through your—through your career also, you know, then you start interacting with people who are talking about the same things as you and that are thinking the same way as you. Yeah, and I think then people—people become easier to work with, or it became easier to interact with them, you know, the more you know about a topic it becomes easier.

And I think these—the councils for these—for these institutes that I was privileged enough to be elected as a president, you know, it's a lot of knowledgeable people and older people that you can learn a lot from. And I particularly enjoyed that. I think it also taught one a lot about meeting structures, about understanding constitutions and interpreting that and the importance of having structures in place to manage things. So I think it also, probably the most valuable lesson was around the importance of our agricultural engineering industry out there, the businesses. That's something that you don't always get exposure to when you're doing academics and things like that.

But when you start sitting on these councils, then you realize we're so dependent on them for vac work for the students, for sponsoring of events, and and for places for people to go and work. So I think it's really important to—to have that link with the industry, and that's where the councils of these different institutes play—play an important role.

Khuthadzo Ntsua: So, what was the outcome that you were most proud of from being a president of any of these organizations?

Isabel van der Stoep: Yeah, I think the majority of my—of what I really felt I achieved something was around the South African Irrigation Institute, or SABI as we refer to it by its Afrikaans acronym. We really, we really pushed the boundaries there. We started an in-house magazine where before it was done by an outside company, publishing house, and we really grew the training program there and and really made very strong bonds with the industry to support that. So I think, yeah, putting that SABI training program in place together with the SABI councils over various years and of course with Rhiana Lombaard, the general manager at the time, it was really, I think the thing that I'm the proudest of that I did. And there were a lot of people involved even.

Khuthadzo Ntsua: So to our listeners who don't know about the SABI magazine, we'll share the link to the magazine in the description box. Let's move on now, Isabel, to talk about some of your activities in your professional journey. You've worked in sustainable irrigation practices and one of them was implementing water irrigation measurement solutions. Why is accurate water measurement such a critical foundation of sustainability?

Isabel van der Stoep: Yeah, that is what I started to get involved in when I did my master's and it was again a result of a project that was offered to us at the University of Pretoria. At the time, I was a junior lecturer in irrigation and the Water Research Commission of South Africa came to us and and said that they—they want to do this—this work on water metering. And it was actually an outcome from that National Water Act, you know, where everything started. Because part of the National Water Act makes provision for—for measuring and implementing measuring and and the Water Research Commission saw this opportunity or a need for us to know more about measurement and specifically measuring of raw water, which is not the same as measuring municipal water which is—which is clean.

In terms of solutions that I've implemented, I cannot unfortunately claim anything for myself to have implemented, but I was involved with various irrigation boards, water user associations, and even individual farmers that—that wanted to measure. And I think the interesting thing today is that now that I'm working outside of the country in our neighboring countries further north, they really have a lot of water. And South Africa is really a water-scarce country. It's, you know, we always say, "Yeah, we're a water-scarce country," but you don't actually realize how scarce it is until you start working in countries where there is an abundance of water. And that is why the measurement is so important.

But yet it's really difficult to implement because it's—it's a tool to—to it's a means to an end. Nobody gets up in the morning and says, "I'm going to install a water meter today" just because I feel like it. It's—it's something that you do because there's a trigger. Either you need to proof that you're not using more water than—than what you're supposed to be using, or there's a dispute with somebody who's trying to control the amount of water that you use. And if there's not a trigger, people don't measure. They just carry on from day to day.

So, I think the technology has come a long way. I think we also have a lot of solutions around around monitoring that's—that's improved largely as the capacity has improved. You know, just—just to be able to collect the data continuously and be able to—to analyze it. And as we are progressing more with—with artificial intelligence and having a large data, you know, if you have the data and you've got the capacity to—to interpret it, then it becomes really useful. And it becomes easier as well. But in the beginning, it was—it was really hard to get measurement implemented, and and I think it's even now still it's—people almost have to be forced to—to implement it.

Khuthadzo Ntsua: I understand in South Africa it's—it's an issue of you must not use too much water because we are we have scarcity. In other countries, what is where there's abundance of water, are the policies around that as well or is it just something that is being done to make sure everybody uses a specific amount of water for irrigation purposes or farming if I can say activities?

Isabel van der Stoep: Yeah, look, it's of course it's a very basic building block for—for assessing sustainability. So—so even in other countries where—where I work, there are water permits that people have to apply for and and then also just in the group that I'm working now in ABF Sugar, when I joined them they were already busy with a—a process of implementing bulk water measurement as part of their ESG drive or their sustainability program. So—so it's—it should be a thing that you want to do without having to be forced to do it. It's the right thing to do.

So, but it's a bit like, you know, it's also good to monitor the fuel consumption in your vehicle, but we all don't all do it, you know? But yes, it is an important tracker for sustainability and I think as our neighboring countries which has got an abundance of water also expand and grow, there will be pressure on them as well. We've just in South Africa, we've—we've already developed the resource, I think, to the extent that we can. There's not much more left to—to develop, and and that's why the measuring is so important because it's a—it's a shared resource.

Khuthadzo Ntsua: You mentioned that measurement is a building block for sustainable water use. And what are some of the practices you've seen contributing to inefficiencies in irrigation and how have engineers been resolving these inefficiencies throughout the years?

Isabel van der Stoep: Yeah, and and I think now we're back to—back to the human factor again. I think as engineers, we can design perfect systems. We can design beautiful engineering solutions. But at the end of the day, somebody has to use it. Some some person has to switch it on and off. And and I think that's where most of the inefficiency occurs is—is where the interaction is between this beautiful engineering solution that we have designed and handing it over to the end user and expecting them then to operate it in the way that—that you intended it to be operated as the as the designer.

I think to a large extent irrigation technology has developed to such an extent that even the—even the best or or any manufacturer's solution actually can do a very good job. It's nothing wrong with the technologies anymore, but it's how we apply it and how we train the people that must use it.

Khuthadzo Ntsua: So is end user training part of every project that you implement?

Isabel van der Stoep: Yes, it should be, and and even in the projects that I'm involved in we normally put it as a project deliverable at the end to say that there should be training involved.

Khuthadzo Ntsua: Working across the continent, I know you've seen a lot, you've experienced a lot, but what is that unique challenge that you've experienced that even today sticks with you and sticks in your mind?

Isabel van der Stoep: You know, if you—if you're working outside of South Africa, a lot of things that we take for granted in South Africa is not necessarily available there. And and probably the biggest engineering challenge, and this is going to sound funny, but is—is actually access to spares. Having access to—to spares to fix things. You know, if you don't have a supplier in the country, it has to be imported, which means it could take two, three weeks, months to get something, you know? And it sounds like such a minor thing, but the—the ability to keep spares to make keep your systems in a running condition and and everything that goes around that, yeah, I think that's—that's probably one of the biggest challenges to running any sort of technical system in in Africa. It's—it really is is part is one of the biggest challenge—challenges.

Khuthadzo Ntsua: Considering the climate variability within the different countries that you've worked in, and having worked mostly in South Africa, what have you had to push yourself to do in terms of your technical knowledge in engineering design that was unique from what you were familiar with?

Isabel van der Stoep: Yeah, so—so the company that I'm working for now, the design work is mostly done by by consulting engineers. So we don't do the designs ourselves, but we do set up the—the scope of work or the terms of reference for—for those projects. And the company that I'm working for now, ABF Sugar, we've—we've got sugarcane estates from Eswatini in the south, which is about 30 degrees south, and and then Zambia, Malawi and up to Tanzania, which is about 8 degrees south of the equator.

So, a couple of interesting things, obviously the closer you get to the equator the higher the rainfall. So—so there is a in terms of an annual demand on the irrigation, it's a little bit less. But if you look at your daily maximums, it can still get to a 7 or an 8 millimeter per day daily demand, which is—which is interesting because it doesn't vary that much across the—across the whole group. But we're growing the same crop of course, so it's—it's very limited in that in that consideration.

But what is interesting to me is that you know, if you look at the ENSO weather phenomenon, which is what most people know as El Niño and La Niña. So, for South Africa, where we where we live, most—most of us live, La Niña means it's a wet year, it's above average rainfalls and and El Niño is a dry year, it's droughts and and late rain and all sorts of complications around that. And it's interesting if you go towards the north of Malawi and the and Tanzania, it actually swaps around. An El Niño year there is a wet year, and a La Niña year is a dry year. So I never knew that, so it's something that you have to make provision for in some of the plans that we make.

I think probably the lessening predictability of of the climate is massive challenge for us, not to design the systems per se, but how we operate the systems. And then the other thing that I think is really important that I've seen is is deforestation. And you might ask, "But why is that now an issue?" In the countries where trees have been—been cut down, we see very, very high rates of of sedimentation and siltation of your rivers and your drains. And you cannot believe the effect that that has on an irrigated estate, you know? It just causes flooding because your riverbed that used to be maybe 2, 3, 4, 5 meters deep, now becomes 1 meter deep. And in some cases, even the riverbeds are higher than the surrounding areas and you just get more and more flooding events. And if you add to that then also more unpredictable rainfall patterns or higher rainfall amounts per event, then it's just a recipe for disaster. And we are seeing this, we definitely see it happening.

Khuthadzo Ntsua: So with the challenge of deforestation, what are you doing to ensure productivity in your fields?

Isabel van der Stoep: Yeah, we—we spending a lot of time and energy in into developing what we call drainage master plans, which is basically investigating the topography of the areas that we farm and then to identify the the causes and the and the places where we have drainage problems and then come up with solutions on how to address that. So—so I think, look, traditionally irrigation and drainage has been a package deal. And and maybe more so in other parts of the world than what we have known in in South Africa and in Africa, but what's definitely happening is that is it's becoming drainage first. You first drain, and then you put the irrigation over the top.

Khuthadzo Ntsua: For you to come up with solutions for irrigation and drainage, you had to become an approved irrigation designer. So you are an approved designer and an evaluator. How does one become an approved irrigation designer and an evaluator?

Isabel van der Stoep: Those two names that—that you used there, the irrigation designer and evaluator, is actually a membership category within SABI, the South African Irrigation Institute. They have an exam that you can write, and then if you get 70% or above, then your membership status then gets converted to a SABI approved irrigation designer. So, and the same with the evaluator, that is not actually a exam, but it is a course that you have to do with them. And if you are an approved designer and you also do the evaluation course, then you also can add that to your to your name. So, so this is a very specific membership category of the South African Irrigation Institute that was developed in the light late 1990s or in the 1990s and they've been carrying on with that ever since. Yeah, that's where it comes from.

Khuthadzo Ntsua: How valuable is it for someone who's involved in irrigation design to have this membership?

Isabel van der Stoep: Yeah, I think the importance of the Irrigation Institute is their very close ties with industry. And yeah, and look there is the whole story about the ECSA prescribing engineering work and things around around that. So I think there are some things there that that still needs to be—be sorted out, but SABI, the Irrigation Institute is also a member of ECSA. And they're also a member of of SAIAE. So—so I think they're working closely together with ECSA and the and with the South African Institute for Agricultural Engineers to make sure that the best solutions are are put are put forward.

I think a lot of the ECSA work is is often if you look at the history of ECSA also there's a very big safety aspect there, that the responsibility that you carry as an engineer to to sign off on things which are safe. In the case of agricultural engineering, it could be like dam wall failures or other work that have potentially life-threatening consequences should they fail. So I think it's also a matter of of looking at the at the scale of things and the and the level of responsibility that is—is needed.

I think one of the things when you when you become a professional engineer with ECSA, I think one of the things we always tell the—the candidate engineers is that when you've just registered, you—you're very dangerous because you—you got the you got the letters behind your name, but you actually don't have all the experience yet. And there's a big responsibility with with knowing what you can do and what you shouldn't be doing. And um I think it's difficult to to put that into a law or a regulation or something, but it's about the way that we train the people, the next generation that's doing the work and the awareness and that comes that comes with it. Just because you are are qualified or just because you got a certain designation behind your name, you should always ask, "Am I qualified to do this work?" It's actually one of the four steps to safety as well, so um it's—it's you should always be asking yourself that.

Khuthadzo Ntsua: As you're reminding the young engineers to be responsible for their actions, what are some of the key competencies they should have or develop for safe practice of irrigation engineering and design?

Isabel van der Stoep: Yeah, I think um there's technical competencies and then there are sort of the softer skills. And um I think over time the universities are always trying to to build in the softer softer skills, but it's I think a lot of that you you learn only when you start working and you get exposed to a workplace environment. And and that's why the place where you go and work is is so important. With the it's about the culture that is there and with the the way they they practice things, the way they develop their young engineers.

But I think, you know, in terms of competencies that that people tend to maybe forget about a little bit is probably time management is one of the critical ones. You know, we live in an age where where we appointing fewer and fewer people and trying to do more and more work and and there are a lot of tools out there that you can use and artificial intelligence is coming in, there's um you know, there's a whole lot of software and things that we use to make everything go faster and and needing fewer people to to do the job. But um the trap is—is time, is you end up working after hours, you end up working through weekends. And I think time—time management is is really critical and and just keeping that that balance.

Then, yeah, obviously the technical skills is important. You gotta stay up to date with with how things are developing. I think in today's life, especially in in agriculture, um is—is having good GIS skills um is—is really critical, a little bit of programming, but I mean even in a GIS environment you can do a bit of programming, but um just to be really good at at spatial spatial software. I think that will will take you a long way.

Khuthadzo Ntsua: And um from your knowledge, besides the I think when you mention the GIS and programming, what are some of the knowledge gaps you've observed for people who end up practicing as irrigation engineers or specializing in irrigation engineering? What are some of the knowledge gaps you've noticed typical in South Africa or I can say in Africa, because you've worked to a certain extent I believe with engineers in the continent as well?

Isabel van der Stoep: Yeah, I think what I've the one thing that stands out to me is lack of soil knowledge. You know, and and in both in irrigation as well as in the mechanization environment. Because there are so many tools available and and so many sources of data, people neglect to go out into the field, dig a profile hole, climb in the hole with all the necessary safety practices, and and look at the profiles and look at the water tables and and really understand soils and yeah, I think I think that's something where where we really um we're really lacking there a little bit.

Khuthadzo Ntsua: I agree with you there. I think it's in practice as a scarce skill among agricultural engineers. So, let's talk about your current role now, managing large-scale sugarcane estates. What are some of the transitions you've had to go through in order to take up that role?

Isabel van der Stoep: Yeah, I think there's two things that stand out for me. The one is being in operations, there's a lot of very um very um not big decisions, but a lot of decisions being made in a very short space of time. So you almost gotta think on your feet the whole time and compensate for that. There's—there's no time to go and investigate something in detail and then to make a decision. You need to make the decision now or in the next five minutes or in the next half an hour because it has a has an effect.

So, you know, coming from a research environment and training, which is incredibly structured and well prepared, that was very hard for me to move over into an operations environment. And and I'd still say, even if you look at all these personality tests and things that you do, I am more of a strategic person rather than an operational person. So that was—that's probably one of the that's probably the hardest thing for me is to adjust to that that operational environment.

And then the second thing is the sheer scale of the of the estates. Where if you do a a simple design for a farmer in South Africa, you know, you're lucky if it's 200 hectares, you know? Our estates we we irrigate about 56,000 hectares and it's divided into to five estates. So it's huge, and it's the just the sheer scale of it to get solutions that work at that scale.

Khuthadzo Ntsua: You also develop guidelines and do quality checklists. What best practices have you identified as non-negotiables for sustaining sugarcane fields?

Isabel van der Stoep: Yeah, I think the the most important thing is—is aligning with the other disciplines within the company, you know, especially from a human resource perspective. So when you start developing guidelines and things like that, you know, it's—it's sometimes really hard to to understand or to you first have to find out exactly how does the the labor side of things work. Things like shifts and seasons and um and just structures, you know, um how do people report into managers? Are they reporting into an engineering manager, are reporting into a crop production manager? Um you know, because if you don't unpack that structure and make sure that you understand how the reporting structure work, it's really tough to to set up a practice um or a checklist or or any guideline that is going to work.

If you're working theoretical and you know, from having started out with a rather academic and theoretical first couple of years of my of my career actually, you know, once once you hit the practice, then you see, hey, this is not so easy. And it's almost a different set of street smart skills that you need to be able to to negotiate negotiate that. And I think if you're working in in another country, where cultures are different, you gotta respect that. Yeah, and and to us safety is a big thing. We have a lot of employees, we've got a lot of contractors, um we work inside communities. There are people moving through the farming area at the same time as what there are big haulage trucks and and machinery moving around. There are schools on the premises with children moving around on the road. So I think that's um the reality of the environment in which you're working and really understanding that, which can take years for a specific um site, I think that's really important. We cannot just engineer in isolation, I think that's important thing.

Khuthadzo Ntsua: Are you aware of technology developments and and practices that are defining the irrigation field in recent years?

Isabel van der Stoep: Yeah, I think the actual technologies that we use to apply the water has not—has not changed that much over years, but I think the remote monitoring is—is for sure to me the the silver bullet. You know, to be able to anytime day of night be able to see what your irrigation system is doing, um whether it's running correctly, whether it's on, whether it's off, um you know, that is just that is exciting. That is really something um new.

And then integrating it maybe with cameras, um with security systems and and engineering out a lot of of problems of managing it, you know? Preventing somebody that has to get up 2 o'clock in the morning to go check whether a dam is—is overflowing, you know, that can now get an an alarm on his phone um while he's sleeping, waking him up saying, "Hey, the dam is 1 meter from its limit," you know, "we're going to switch the pumps off." You know, the the remote monitoring and control options around irrigation systems is just phenomenal. Um I think that's—that's really where the big is going to be a big part of our future.

Khuthadzo Ntsua: And is that maybe transforming the theft that used to be a big problem in irrigation, whether it's a stealing of a components, a pump, what is is that transforming also resolving that issue?

Isabel van der Stoep: Yeah, I think it that if you want to engineer that out, it starts from the design, you know, thinking about um how you're going to install cables and different components and how you're going to secure it. So um it's always easier to to get it right from the beginning than try to to add it on on later later on, but it's definitely yes. A remote monitoring definitely contributes to creating a a more secure environment.

Khuthadzo Ntsua: What is that one policy you would implement to achieve sustainable irrigation and water management in South Africa?

Isabel van der Stoep: (Sigh) Hey, um I think um I think soil conservation. I think soil conservation has fallen by the wayside. The the Department of Agriculture that still probably supporting it I think is probably a little bit light on resources. And having seen what I've seen in Malawi and Tanzania, where you've got massive siltation of your rivers, if that should happen in South Africa, and it's it probably is already to some degree, um we're going to have much worse problems. So I think if one can can reinforce or reinstate soil conservation technicians and the soil conservation practices that were in place, I think that would be the one thing that I would would want to do.

Khuthadzo Ntsua: What message would you give to that young engineer who's listening to the podcast?

Isabel van der Stoep: Yeah, I said a while ago, I think it was as part of the South African Institute for Agricultural Engineer meetings and when I was still on the on the council there and um to me I would like a student or a person considering a career not to say "I want to become an agricultural engineer" or "I want to become an irrigation engineer." You should actually say, "I want to go and work at" this and this place, "and that is what I want to do there." Because and then you set yourself up for saying, "Okay, but if I want to go and be an irrigation engineer at a consulting engineering firm, what do I need to study? What is the best route for me to get there?"

The problem is for you to know that that is what you want to do at a very specific workplace, you need exposure. So it takes you a little bit back to say, "All right, I want to study engineering, but where am I going to work one day?" And I think it's really important from the very first year of studies that people get out there, try to do their their vac work, try even if they volunteer, even if they work for free, even if they just shadow somebody, get as much exposure to the workplace from day one. Because that, that is where you're going to make contacts, and that is where you're going to get your job.

It's not from applying for jobs on the internet, sending your CV, sending your CV, sending your CV, that is not what gets you a job. What gets you a job is experience and exposure and meeting people. So go to your SAIAE meetings, go to your SABI meetings, um meet people, find out what they do. That—that is going to help you get started in life. I think a lot of young people, and it's not only in engineering, people go and study something and then they get the degree or the certificate or whatever they did, and then they can't find work. But while you're a student and you have got a little bit of freedom, try to find out about workplaces. Don't wait until you're in your last year or the last month of your studies. Do it from day one.

Khuthadzo Ntsua: You've said a mouthful, Isabel, today, and we thank you for taking time from your busy schedule to talk to us today. We really appreciate it. Until the next time, thank you very much.

Isabel van der Stoep: No, thank you for the invitation, I really um appreciate it.

(Outro Music - upbeat with nature sounds)

Khuthadzo Ntsua: Well, that was it from Miss Isabel van der Stoep who talked with us about her journey in irrigation engineering. Thank you for listening to the Agricultural Engineering Podcast. Please don't forget to like, share with your family, share with your friends and anyone who might have interest. For more information, you can check in the description box, and with that said, until the next episode, it is goodbye for now.